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    A trait is good only if it reliably produces good outcome... — Carmelics
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    Part of a larger discussion

    Challenges→The virtues are good.

    A trait is good only if it reliably produces good outcomes across contexts, not merely by expressing rational order.

    ?Rate how convincing each reason is below to see the overall strength.
    1 reason for
    1 reason against

    Reasons For

    1 perspective
    Reason for
    ?
    • 1.Virtues like honesty sometimes produce harmful outcomes; calling them 'good' requires empirical validation across contexts, not just logical coherence.
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    • 2.A trait's rationality doesn't guarantee goodness—rational self-interest can reliably produce outcomes we'd call immoral.
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    • 3.Moral claims should track what actually improves human flourishing, which requires testing traits' real-world consequences, not their internal logic.
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    Reasons Against

    1 perspective
    Reason against
    ?
    • 1.Some traits (justice, compassion) appear good precisely because they embody rational order, independent of contingent outcome measurement.
      ?

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    • 2.Outcome-based evaluation requires a pre-existing standard of 'good outcomes'—this standard itself cannot be justified through outcomes without circularity.
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    • 3.Reliable outcome-production varies by context; this makes 'goodness' culturally relative, conflicting with our intuition that some traits are objectively virtuous.
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    Connections

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    Virtue Ethics1 linked

    Related

    A trait's rationality doesn't guarantee goodness—rational self-interest can reli...Moral claims should track what actually improves human flourishing, which requir...Outcome-based evaluation requires a pre-existing standard of 'good outcomes'—thi...Reliable outcome-production varies by context; this makes 'goodness' culturally ...
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    Some traits (justice, compassion) appear good precisely because they embody rati...The virtues are good.Virtues like honesty sometimes produce harmful outcomes; calling them 'good' req...

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    claim
    Perspectives
    2 (1 for, 1 against)
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