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    Carmelics

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    LoyalLoyalJusticeJustice
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    If deserved suffering were intrinsically good, we would b... — Carmelics
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    Challenges→Deserved suffering inflicted by a proper punitive desert agent is inherently good.

    If deserved suffering were intrinsically good, we would be obligated to maximize it, yet no retributivist accepts that torturing a murderer indefinitely becomes progressively better—revealing the 'inherent good' claim is incoherent.

    ?Rate how convincing each reason is below to see the overall strength.
    1 reason for
    1 reason against

    Reasons For

    1 perspective
    Reason for
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    • 1.If X is intrinsically good, rational agents should want more of X when possible, all else equal.
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    • 2.Retributivists don't endorse infinite torture, suggesting they don't believe deserved suffering is intrinsically good.
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    • 3.Therefore, retributivism relies on instrumental or threshold-based justifications, not intrinsic goodness claims.
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    Reasons Against

    1 perspective
    Reason against
    ?
    • 1.Intrinsic goods can have diminishing marginal value or satiation points without ceasing to be intrinsically good.
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    • 2.Retributivists may limit punishment via proportionality principles, not because suffering lacks intrinsic value, but because excess violates fairness.
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    • 3.The argument conflates 'unlimited maximization is obligatory' with 'intrinsic goodness,' but constraints on maximization don't negate intrinsic value.
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    Key Terms

    Incoherent(describing whether moral responsibility can exist)
    Logically impossible or contradictory; something that cannot make sense or cannot exist at the same time as something else.
    MAXIMIZE(Maddy's philosophy of set theory)
    A set-theoretic maxim identified by Penelope Maddy, cashed out as the principle of positing as many sets as possible
    intrinsically good(Distinction drawn between intrinsic and instrumental goodness of virtue)
    Good in itself, independent of any further consequences or instrumental role.
    obligated(as used in ethics)
    Having a moral or logical duty to do something; being required to do it.
    retributivist(as used in philosophy of punishment)
    A person who believes that punishment should be given because wrongdoers deserve it, not just to prevent future crimes or help them reform.

    Connections

    1 topic

    Justice & Punishment1 linked

    Related

    Deserved suffering inflicted by a proper punitive desert agent is inherently goo...If X is intrinsically good, rational agents should want more of X when possible,...Intrinsic goods can have diminishing marginal value or satiation points without ...Retributivists don't endorse infinite torture, suggesting they don't believe des...
    +3 moreShow less
    Retributivists may limit punishment via proportionality principles, not because ...The argument conflates 'unlimited maximization is obligatory' with 'intrinsic go...

    Details

    Type
    claim
    Perspectives
    2 (1 for, 1 against)
    Edits
    1 edit
    Therefore, retributivism relies on instrumental or threshold-based justification...